There is a God.... - Page 28

kidicarus5897 · 09-08-2008, 02:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOODOLEDAYS1016

You might be on to something.

Excerpt’s from 29+ Evidences for macroevolution
"The worldwide scientific research community from over the past 140 years has discovered that no known hypothesis other than universal common descent can account scientifically for the unity, diversity, and patterns of terrestrial life."

This is one huge contradictory statement. If you discover something, you have physical evidence. A theory or hypothesis is no longer needed and your findings should be reported. Nevertheless, they refer to a "known hypothesis" and promote it as scienctific. Question: How do you have a "known hypothesis" (known guess?)? It is still just that, a guess.

".

You are completely tarded if.............you are tarded.

GOODOLEDAYS1016 · 09-08-2008, 02:42 AM

Seriously, look at what is being said. This scientific community is not looking at any other "known hypothesis" other than UCD, and they state that no other way scientifically makes sense. Come on, gimme a break. With God, all things are possible. Including the creation.

NightIP · 09-08-2008, 02:56 AM

Nobody is saying that the Bible is outright false. I believe that many of the things written in there are completely true, and yes, much of it has been proven archeologically and/or scientifically to have happened. However, it all comes down to how you view some of the miraculous acts that are written about in the book itself.

Did Jesus exist? Most probably. Did Pontius Pilate rule during the time of Jesus? Absolutely. That's been proven. Did Jesus rise from the dead to save all of mankind? Ehh, not so proven. That's where people like me have a big hangup. Many of us simply can't take it on faith alone that it did happen the way it was written. Let me tell you my story:

I actually grew up as a Christian. I went to church, had a Christian family, even went to a Christian highschool. Up until highschool I had no reason to doubt any of it; my family and church said that the Bible was correct, so therefore I took their word for it that it was. That's how many children are brought up: faith through transmission. Somewhere in highschool I began to have doubts, however. I was taking a comparative religion class at my school, and began thinking about just how fervently other religions believe in their own god(s). Muslims believe in Allah, Hindus believe in Vishnu, Brahma and Shiva (among others), Buddhists believe in the teachings of Buddha, etc. For each and every religion on this planet, people have believed so fervently that they've died for their god(s).

As I sat in this class listening to the teacher talk about these other religions with a Christian bias, discussing how every other religion was outright wrong, it hit me: Christians are no different than anyone else. Christians believe in the Trinity just as fervently as a Muslim might believe in Allah. If you ask the Christian who is right, he'll invariably say that Jesus is Lord. If you ask the Muslim, he will invariably, and just as strongly, assert that Allah is the one and only God. Looking at it from this point of view, it became obvious that religion is simply a matter of perspective. Were you born in Iran? You're probably a Muslim. Were you born in Israel? You're probably a Jew.

This reasoning caused a large strain on my faith. I felt that I couldn't logically worship a Holy Trinity when next door people were bowing to Mecca. I fought this feeling for at least a year. I wanted to hold on to my belief in Christianity. I wanted to believe that there was more to life than what meets the eye. One morning, however, I woke up and didn't have it in me. I realized that what I was doing was silly: I couldn't logically believe in a god that had so many religions competing for the same answers.

To let go of my faith, to let go of Christianity, was like lifting a huge weight off my shoulders. I could finally look at the world in a way that embraced logic over faith, without a guilty conscience. My Dad soon followed suit, with the same feeling of relief. It was very freeing to just let go and let your mind explore other possibilities without fear of reprisal from the Church or a god written about in a book.

To this day, I still get people that tell me that I should go back to the Church so that I don't go to hell. That's hardly a threat to a person like me; I simply don't believe in a heaven or a hell, and only makes me feel bad for that person who lives their life in fear of eternal damnation.

Caleb, let's be clear: I'm not trying to sway you from your beliefs. It's obvious that you're happy believing what you believe. That's great. However, many of us choose different paths, and we all have beliefs that are just as adamant as yours even if they differ from what's written in the Bible.

Anyway, I think this post has gone on quite far enough, so I'll leave it at that. Have a good night.

GOODOLEDAYS1016 · 09-08-2008, 03:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NightIP

Nobody is saying that the Bible is outright false. I believe that many of the things written in there are completely true, and yes, much of it has been proven archeologically and/or scientifically to have happened. However, it all comes down to how you view some of the miraculous acts that are written about in the book itself.

Did Jesus exist? Most probably. Did Pontius Pilate rule during the time of Jesus? Absolutely. That's been proven. Did Jesus rise from the dead to save all of mankind? Ehh, not so proven. That's where people like me have a big hangup. Many of us simply can't take it on faith alone that it did happen the way it was written. Let me tell you my story:

I actually grew up as a Christian. I went to church, had a Christian family, even went to a Christian highschool. Up until highschool I had no reason to doubt any of it; my family and church said that the Bible was correct, so therefore I took their word for it that it was. That's how many children are brought up: faith through transmission. Somewhere in highschool I began to have doubts, however. I was taking a comparative religion class at my school, and began thinking about just how fervently other religions believe in their own god(s). Muslims believe in Allah, Hindus believe in Vishnu, Brahma and Shiva (among others), Buddhists believe in the teachings of Buddha, etc. For each and every religion on this planet, people have believed so fervently that they've died for their god(s).

As I sat in this class listening to the teacher talk about these other religions with a Christian bias, discussing how every other religion was outright wrong, it hit me: Christians are no different than anyone else. Christians believe in the Trinity just as fervently as a Muslim might believe in Allah. If you ask the Christian who is right, he'll invariably say that Jesus is Lord. If you ask the Muslim, he will invariably, and just as strongly, assert that Allah is the one and only God. Looking at it from this point of view, it became obvious that religion is simply a matter of perspective. Were you born in Iran? You're probably a Muslim. Were you born in Israel? You're probably a Jew.

This reasoning caused a large strain on my faith. I felt that I couldn't logically worship a Holy Trinity when next door people were bowing to Mecca. I fought this feeling for at least a year. I wanted to hold on to my belief in Christianity. I wanted to believe that there was more to life than what meets the eye. One morning, however, I woke up and didn't have it in me. I realized that what I was doing was silly: I couldn't logically believe in a god that had so many religions competing for the same answers.

To let go of my faith, to let go of Christianity, was like lifting a huge weight off my shoulders. I could finally look at the world in a way that embraced logic over faith, without a guilty conscience. My Dad soon followed suit, with the same feeling of relief. It was very freeing to just let go and let your mind explore other possibilities without fear of reprisal from the Church or a god written about in a book.

To this day, I still get people that tell me that I should go back to the Church so that I don't go to hell. That's hardly a threat to a person like me; I simply don't believe in a heaven or a hell, and only makes me feel bad for that person who lives their life in fear of eternal damnation.

Caleb, let's be clear: I'm not trying to sway you from your beliefs. It's obvious that you're happy believing what you believe. That's great. However, many of us choose different paths, and we all have beliefs that are just as adamant as yours even if they differ from what's written in the Bible.

Anyway, I think this post has gone on quite far enough, so I'll leave it at that. Have a good night.

I admire your post. I on the other hand, even though I grew up in a Christian home, I never believed or thought about it. We werent to wild about any of it really. My dad never went to church, my mom did sometimes. We went whenever. I went to a non christian school, non christian college, etc... I believed all that was put in front of me let my thoughts run rampant about how we came to be, what comes next, but I never thought about God. Never. One day, out of nowhere, He showed up. He came into my life when I was least expecting it and showed me exactly what it was the He (Christ) did for us. I came to Him as a child. I cant express what happened to me except, he changed me. He saved me. I had no idea before. Say what you want, I know. It sounds crazy, but I believe all of it and I believe in Him. The Son of God, that grew up in Jerusalem, became a carpenter, and later the King of Kings. He changed my life forever. He showed me how much He loves us all.
I believe that all religions in this world (with the exception of buddhists and JW, and mormons, and well there are a few) all try to serve the same God. Allah is arabic for God, YHWH or Adonai is jewish, and so on. They are not names of God, but rather words that mean title/stature of diety. Almost every religion that originates from the Middle East area talks of God (Adonai or Jehovah for Christians). People turn to rules and laws when the power and presence of God are not there, and they end up with religion. People think that because the "do this" or "dont do that" that they are spiritual. That is religion. Rules without the power of God. Most religions believe in God, and most even mention Jesus, but Christianity (followers and believers of Christ) actually aknowledge Him as the Messiah. Furthermore, every other religion in the world is based on works. Again, if you "do this" or "dont do this" you will go to heaven. Without Christ you can not get to heaven.
Why do you need enlightenment when Jesus is the way, the truth, and the light?
The main thing that seperates believers from non believers is that God sent His only Son to earth to redeem us, and until you turn to Him or He crashes into your life, if God so wills this to happen, then it is not something you or I can do on our own. He is God. What else can I say? We can never understand Him or His thoughts. We dont know what He has instore for us in the future. But I do know that He loves us. He has shown it to us.
I do not live my life in fear of eternal damnation. I know I have rebelled against God for most of my life and still do, alot! But I know that my sins are forgiven. I know that I have no condemnation from Him. I no longer have to be afraid of hell, because I know I wont be there.

I will pray that God shows His love to you. May God bless you all and show all of you His love, regardless.

Caleb Elliott
If any of you want to call and talk to me, feel free to PM me...

PhantomHawk · 09-08-2008, 04:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOODOLEDAYS1016

Caleb Elliott
If any of you want to call and talk to me, feel free to PM me...

I'll save them the trouble.
(816) 377-7051

(yes, it's a dick move. I'm sick of you. My God is ashamed that you are representing Him.)

GOODOLEDAYS1016 · 09-08-2008, 04:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhantomHawk

I'll save them the trouble.
(816) 377-7051

That one is old.
Just curious, I answered your question about my faith, now its your turn. What do you believe?

Even though God does love us, He hates sin. And we are all sinners deserving a sinners death. We have been justified by the blood of Jesus, meaning we have been sanctified by Jesus. He was our propitiation. The Son of the Living God was made flesh and dwelt among us, died for us under the full wrath of God, and rose again and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God until He makes His triumphant return. But if you reject Him, He will reject you. And if you do not serve Him who created you and is willing to save you, then you are against Him and are going to hell. I am not trying to use that to scare you or anyone else into believing, but without God you have nothing. Without Him, we are nothing. Salvation is of the Lord God Almighty, through His only Son. He paid the ultimate price for us. I know you dont want to hear that, but it is the truth. Everything you ever wanted to know about God is in the Scriptures. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God.
Our lives are but vapors before the Lord. He does not need anything to prove His exsistence, let alone a bunch of ego meniacal pilots debating His exsistence, to prove His exsistence.

"There is salvation in no one else; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men, by which we must be saved" (Acts 4:12).

Suave · 09-08-2008, 08:06 AM

We just had this discussion during our service at church. Our pastor used the example of a man wanting to travel to London, England. He goes to his travel agent and says he wants to go to London and the travel agent says, "Well just get in your car and drive west, all roads go to London." He then goes to the train station, the airport, and to a cruise line, only to be told the same thing. "All trains, airplanes, and boats go to London." Is this true.....of course not. So how can all religions serve the same GOD?

I have been a Christian for a long time and know this..., I can't convince you by words alone that God is real, I must show you by the way I live my life for Christ. Christians "talk the talk, but seldom do we walk the walk." We are usually the ones throwing the first stone. That being said, we also know that we are sinners and that no one is without sin. But if we confess that sin and try hard each day not to continue sinning that same way, we are forgiven.

I understand that many of you were raised and told to believe, others have never been in a church or a Christian family. That doesn't mean you will not experience God for yourself eventually. The Bible says that all man (and woman) will have the opportunity to know God. That being said, you can't find God with your head, you have to seek him with your heart. Those of you that are married, how did you know that you loved your husband or wife. You felt love it in your heart, right? That is how you come to know God too. You surrender your life and your heart to him. You WILL feel him, that I can promise you....only if you give your heart a chance to feel him. I can feel God's presence just like I can feel the love for my wife and my children...in my heart, not in my head.

I hope that those of you that know me see that I live my life for Christ. And if you don't see that, then I have some major reflection coming and changes in my life rather than from my mouth.

Take care,
Rick Childers

PhantomHawk · 09-08-2008, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOODOLEDAYS1016

....I answered your question about my faith, now its your turn. What do you believe?

I believe that as a guy who proclaims he has an IQ of 131, you should learn how to spell. EGOMANIACAL (all one word), EGO + MANIAC (you) = EGOMANIAC. And, EXISTENCE does not have 2 S's. Ordinarily this would be extremely petty, but you told us all what a smart guy you are.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOODOLEDAYS1016

...He does not need anything to prove His exsistence, let alone a bunch of ego meniacal pilots debating His exsistence, to prove His exsistence.

Your vast qualifications...

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOODOLEDAYS1016

I have a college degree (physics, chemistry), an IQ of 131, CFI, CFII, MEI, AGI, IGI, and again, the list goes on.

GOODOLEDAYS1016 · 09-08-2008, 09:59 AM

Well said Rick.
I will add that I was not trying to say that every religion worships the same god, but the names of the gods they worship are just titles for their diety. If it came out that away, I am sorry.

Some people think it doesn't matter what you believe as long as you're sincere. But without a valid object your faith is useless. If you take poison--thinking it's medicine--all the faith in the world won't restore your life. Similarly, if Jesus is the only source of salvation, and you're trusting in anyone or anything else for your salvation, your faith is useless.

Many people assume there are many paths to God and that each religion represents an aspect of truth. But Jesus said, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me" (John 14:6). He didn't claim to be one of many equally legitimate paths to God, or the way to God for His day only. He claimed to be the only way to God--then and forever.

It isn't enough to believe certain facts about Christ. Even Satan and his demons believe in the true God (James 2:19), but they don't love and obey Him. Their faith is not genuine. True saving faith always responds in obedience (Ephesians 2:10).
All who reject Jesus as their Lord and Savior will one day face Him as their Judge: "God is now declaring to men that all everywhere should repent, because He has fixed a day in which He will judge the world in righteousness through a Man whom He has appointed, having furnished proof to all men by raising Him from the dead" (Acts 17:30-31).

Who do you say Jesus is? That is the question. He alone can redeem you--free you from the power and penalty of sin. He alone can transform you, restore you to fellowship with God, and give your life eternal purpose. Will you repent and believe in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior?

Phantom,
you have proven my point. Even though someone claims to know everything (and my wife tells me I do this all the time) it doesnt matter what pieces of paper or plastic we hold, or how intelligent we claim to be. God is still more intelligent than us even in His foolishness. Our intelligence is pointless. Even with all of those "smart guy/girl accomplishments", I was using as a form of credibility, it means nothing.

With that said, you still have not answered my question....Who do you think Jesus is?

preludespeeder · 09-08-2008, 11:07 AM

Wow, is all I can say about you religious nuts on here. You will twist every scientific fact with what ever little thing you imagine in your head. I have little exercise for you to try, take every argument that you have applied to scientific reasoning and apply it to your fairy tale book, them come back to me and tell me why we think you are crazy. Every thing you attack science for is exactly why I do not believe in religion. Your arguments have no merit or base for saying it is wrong. If you think you have some sort of lead in this argument, again you are wrong. Most of us can not even fathom how you come up with these statements. The argument that since all roads don't go to London is why there are many different gods. Wow. That is the most stupidest thing I have ever read in my life. Yet you come on here like that is brilliance. I think my IQ just dropped a few points after trying to even read and understand that like it was a real argument.

Here are some facts for you, 13 billion years old, 4.5 billion years old, fossils, and more fossils. What do you bring, ah one meaning of theory is this and I went to my travel agent and he said blah blah. Keep living your fairy tale.